How would anyone know who hires who...? If a company is good, they hire best writers and vice-versa.

When a customer orders a paper from custompapers.com, the company forwards the email address of the customer to the writer, thats what they say on their website. Hence, the customer can keep in touch with the writer through email. By this, he can ask or may be guess, whether the writer is an American, British or from other country.

It doesn't. Of course. (Custompapers.com hiring ESLs)

I've been following the discussions on this forum with great interest over the past 24 hours because I'm a new writer at essaywriters.net and am somewhat suspicious about their ability/willingness to pay.
Full Disclosure: I am an Indian/Pakistani (Since Amy likes to fuse our identities and I'm not actually that interested in prying us apart).
This does NOT mean, automatically, that I've been hired by essaywriters.net in a damage-control exercise.

I've never been to the US, have lived all my life in a small town in India/Pakistan and yet I aspire to be a writer in English. (*gasp* *shock & awe*) Because it's the language I'm most comfortable expressing myself in. (NEVER start a sentence with "Because").
This lengthy preamble because I want to avoid being baited as some of my unfortunate compatriots have.

Here's what I like about essaywriters.net.
1) They're NOT stuck up about hiring Indian/Pakistanis who can write. So if I want to be a work-at-home writer in this industry (we Indian/Pakistanis are also entitled to desire that kind of life), and I don't want to leave my country AND I have some degree of competence or pretended competence at what I do.. where do I begin? (Here's Amy's cue to rant about how this *isn't* a forum to promote good sites! Go.. elsewhere for that. WHERE?).

2) They give amateur writers a chance to get paid for writing, or to try at any rate. Ok, so maybe the average Indian/Pakistani ESL writer is incapable of writing an acceptable US "college" thesis. But that's really a very blinkered way of looking at the market and pretending that the ONLY buyers you get are dishonest gullible redneck Master's and Ph.D students in the US. I think the market for gibberish (two page write-ups on c*ap) is as large as the market for arcane scholarly dissertations. And (*groan* not a sentence beginning with "And"!) I have hunch that's where there's space for us oily goat-milking Indian/Pakistanis to make ourselves useful. As self-deprecatory as that sounds, even the worst of us is useful because we are completing the bullsh*t projects of clients whom your Ph.d saturated industry is too stuck-up to service. Gradually, very innocuously we're graduating your country's finest. In that process we're graduating ourselves. What's really going to scare the Amys of the world is if somehow, we oily goat-milking Indians actually begin to produce "US standard" (oxymoronish, no?) dissertations. Ofcourse that thought has never occured to her/him.

3) The work is interesting! Really. So, (tut tut) I'm not ONLY on a trip of looting hapless US/UK/Canada students of their bottom-dollar. I find that some of the projects on this site are really interesting and are issues, the study of which would add to my own "perspective". I just finished a somewhat complex project in a subject that lay in the borderlands of my area of specialization, which required me to digest a lot of material that I wouldn't have encountered in the ordinary course. (Can't suppress a boast here: I got a "Very satisfied" review from my customer for my very first project. Yay.) Maybe essaywriters.net won't pay me at the end of it, but like the user "rat" says, my insurance is that I can copyright "my" paper. And although it is unacceptable not to be paid, there's some consolation to be gained from the fact that we're enriched in other ways. This is not only an industry which produces "non-plagiarised" material - it is also in the business of originality.

4) They paid some of the members of this forum *after* explicit attacks vented against them. That shows a creeping degree of good-faith that isn't easy to dismiss off-hand.

The things that make me uncomfortable about essaywriters.com:
1) Obviously, they're not paying on time. I can see how that can be disastrous to those who rely on this as their primary source of income. I wish they'd take more care and invest more time in their primary resource. Or atleast invest some more in retaining their better writers. As Amy pointed out, I have a hunch they'll hire anyone. I advance my own admission as evidence. But there has to be a mechanism to ensure that the better writers amongst the lot are treated with more dignity - not necessarily paid better although that would be ideal. Perhaps they ought to build up quasi-personal relationships with their veteran/trusted writers. Pay them even for projects that don't pay up. I'm sure they have the money for it.
2) They evidently don't back their own writers. I refer to one of the instances where plagiarism was indicated in the "Works Cited" page. This is alarming, more so because I am a lazy referencer. I prefer to copy/paste citation entries where available, instead of reconstructing them from scratch. But this is indicative of their apathy towards their own writers. It's not something which immediately brands them as evil, but it does make them impossible to ever trust to any great degree.
3) They don't let you communicate directly with the client. They do have a link that lets you send a message to the client, but I'm fairly certain they're screening all messages to and from the client. It takes inordinately long for the client to respond and I can't believe that is because he/she only accesses the internet once a day. It is annoying because it holds up your work when you need an important clarification from the client.
4) Where on earth are they located? I must admit this is the most disconcerting aspect of all. I can understand that admitting you're based in the Ukraine, and then attempting to sell to a primarily American/UK market will ensure your business is a non-starter. Especially when purchases come with prejudices of the sort Amy harbours. But it doesn't make it very easy for us to trust them. Its curious that the user "Beth" claims to be an accounts officer of some sort for the outfit. I imagine she would have an office somewhere..


Other things I wanted to talk about:
1) I cannot stress enough how valuable this site is - even as solely anti-essaywriters.net as it may seem. I applaud the vitriol of such dedicated members as Amy and others. I think the existence of the possibility of a backlash from their writers alone will either compell them take remedial action or will bring them down. Both of which are positive outcomes. I'm secretly rooting for the former. I hope the user "Beth" is paying attention.

2) There was a suggestion that we Indian/Pakistanis are undercutting the wages of the good American Ph.D expert essay-writers (ofcourse writers never earn "wages". That's the disgraceful stuff labourers earn.). But then again, maybe that's in fact why this market is viable at all. All the fraud essay writing sites that dangle hopes in front of beleagured out-of-cash students in the US/UK/Canada, invisibly line the pockets of the Custompapers.com-s and ukessays.com-s. People who can only afford $8 a page aren't your primary customers, but that doesn't mean they're not customers at all. I know you want to set up an intergalactic empire of pure-bred US/UK/Canada essaywriters who work from home. But maybe there's place even for the riff-raff to set up shop. It's certainly the riff-raff who're your clients. (Oh Come ON!)

3) Data on Alexia indicates that Indians are the top visitors at essaywriters.net (http://www.alexa.com/data/details/traffic_details?url=essaywriters.net). Hm. For really surprising results check Custompapers.com's entry (http://www.alexa.com/data/details/traffic_details?q=&url=custompapers.com)

4) I dont know if any of you are struck by how bizarre this industry is, where both the buyers and the real sellers (the actual writers) operate in shadows - being unable to fully disclose their identities. It's fertile ground for scam essay webistes to make a killing.

5) What wondeful times we live in.

I'm sorry if this sounds like an Anti Amy entry. I'm sure he/she'll have a lot to say in return. Racist is the wrong word to apply to him/her. It's the supreme condescension and the cavalier ease with which (s)he's prepared to dismiss countries and cultures (OfCOURSE they're a scam. They're from UKRAINE) that's irritating.
On the other hand, I'm really in awe of the command he/she obviously possesses over the English language. I can't help being very self-conscious in this regard. I haven't run this entry through a spell check and I hope you won't be its substitute - as you have with other users. I disclaim proficiency in the apocryphal "American English" at the outset.
It was a pleasure to read the more balanced opinions of users like "coder" and "Dylan" and a real treat to receive advice on writing from the "rat". (Definite sign that we've progressed as a planet, when we can say the last part of that sentence without being considered a lunatic)
Thanks for all.

Please quote a single instance of my "prejudice," and I'll explain exactly how you are completely wrong.

Why all the talk about goats?

Being a crook in UKRAINE cannot possibly be any worse than being a crook anywhere else.



Here are three instances. I don't want to press the issue. You may of course think (THINK) you are not being prejudiced ("prejudiced") but it is quite manifest. Others have said it before. Like I said, I don't want to press the issue. You're entitled to your prejudices.

I have to side with gibreel Amy. You come across as prejudice. It's the main reason I was picking on you earlier today. There is a mean hateful undertone to your postings whenever you mention writers and companies from other countries.

FYI in case you haven't seen it yet I located the LLC for that company you said didn't exsit. I posted a link on the thread.

Thank you rat.
I'm just wondering, has there been any discussion on this forum about the legitimacy of this industry as a whole? It seems to me, at least in India, that you would not be able to organise a business of this sort. It comes squarely within the description of "cheating" (inducing a person to act in a way they would not otherwise act - i.e inducing universities to award degrees).
Further, if there exist analogous provisions in other jurisdictions, I think the heroic attempts by some to physically locate these organisations is futile because after that, what? You cannot possibly sue them, imho, because most jurisdictions also require that the plaintiff approach the court with "clean hands". So a customer cannot possibly sue.
I'm curious to know how companies like ukessays.com or custompapers.com are able to maintain their claim to legitimacy.
I find this the most fascinating aspect of this industry by far. That it can only exist in the nebulous amoral nether world of the internet and that redress for complaints are only possible again, on the internet.

Gibreel, your "quotes" are so very weak. Ever heard of a little thing called CONTEXT? Hmm, I wonder why you didn't include the ENTIRE POSTS.

Deep thoughts, by Jack Handy . . . .

Because I'm from essaywriters.net. BOO.

Truth be told I haven't explored the legality of this bizz. In my opinion the entire thing is unethical. Consider the possibility that one of these students using purchased papers could one day be your doctor.

touche' jibreel...loved ur post

and i've probably spelt that wrong...kill me AMY why dont you?

this is what my last customer had to say:

"please dont write exceleent english, my teacher knows how i write, something awesome will make him suspiscious" JOHN

and he was american...
this is why some of us "ESL" writers are hired....
we make grammatical errors...we make spelling mistakes...but we get the job done and we make it look REAL!

and they're many websites that respect imperfect essays!

Hey Saba,
You're right about that, and its a point I wanted to make, but didn't get around to making.
Although your client in this instance was American, I get the impression that a majority of clients are in fact students of other nationalities working through their college degrees in the US/UK. Perhaps I'm wrong about that.
Which site do you use? How long have you been at this? Do they pay you?
Anyway.. on a different note, its too bad both our teams crashed out of the world cup eh?

Rat,
My first impressions on the ethics of the scheme were identical. But some of the testimonials at Custompapers.com beg a reconsideration of the issue. For instance http://www.korepetycje.com/graduate.html - where a physiotherapist admits to using the service and claims that it gave him more time to gain valuable hands-on experience in treating patients!

You think that the "testimonials" on essay sites are real? LOL!

I can see your point but I disagree with it. Professors hand those assignments out for a reason. If an assignment is given to a student to do a report on space flight and the student purchases the paper what has he learned? Consider how much information you take in when you're researching a paper that you don't use in the final product.

Don't forget the researching skills you develop when you research your paper. What happens if that doctor you mention runs across a patient with a condition he's never seen before? Had he researched all his papers he'd have an easier time researching the patient's condition.

First of all, that person clearly communicated intent to CHEAT, but you and BestEssays.com served him anyway, which blatantly violated the statutes of virtually every state. (Yes, look it up, rat!)

Secondly, any American writer (me, for instance) can "dumb down" his/her writing, but an ESL writer with poor grammar won't be able to write at my level (in the English language).

who's competing with you Amy?

I'm only saying that ESL writers are serving a different market...

(I'm writing 2 pagers and I don't EVER plan on writing dissertations)

Jibreel...the world cup is still a touchy subject here...I'm rooting for SriLanka now..

Zig-Zag, the cigarette paper makers, knows most people use their product to smoke week yet they still manufacter the papers. What's your point? More hair splitting and holding them to a higher standard than you hold others.



I wonder is this is the foundation of all your hate and anger. Were you constantly passed over for work that was given to "ESL" writers?

I'm sorrry that you label FACTS as "hate and anger."

I'm not labeling the "facts" as hate and anger, I'm labeling your actions and words as hate and anger. I'm sorry if you don't understand that.